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	<title>Comments on: Enlightenment 3.0</title>
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	<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html</link>
	<description>Live to see it.</description>
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		<title>By: M. Simon</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1285</link>
		<dc:creator>M. Simon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Mar 2006 15:45:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1285</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Goedel put Descartes into the dust bin of history. Surprising so few have heard of him.

What we have left is muddling through with rationality as a guide.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Goedel put Descartes into the dust bin of history. Surprising so few have heard of him.</p>
<p>What we have left is muddling through with rationality as a guide.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Saint-Andre</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1284</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Saint-Andre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Mar 2006 21:28:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1284</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi Phil, more comments at my blog, specifically &lt;a href=&#039;http://www.saint-andre.com/blog/2006-03.html#2006-03-06T21:13&#039; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Phil, more comments at my blog, specifically <a href='http://www.saint-andre.com/blog/2006-03.html#2006-03-06T21:13' rel="nofollow">here</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Saint-Andre</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1283</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Saint-Andre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Mar 2006 15:36:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1283</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hmm, the British Enlightenment will be better equipped to address the challenges of the Singularity -- have you read Jim Bennett&#039;s book &lt;a href=&#039;http://www.anglospherechallenge.com/&#039; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The Anglosphere Challenge&lt;/a&gt;? It makes that argument at length. Also check out &lt;a href=&#039;http://anglosphere.com/weblog/&#039; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Albion&#039;s Seedlings&lt;/a&gt;, the group blog to which Jim contributes.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, the British Enlightenment will be better equipped to address the challenges of the Singularity &#8212; have you read Jim Bennett&#8217;s book <a href='http://www.anglospherechallenge.com/' rel="nofollow">The Anglosphere Challenge</a>? It makes that argument at length. Also check out <a href='http://anglosphere.com/weblog/' rel="nofollow">Albion&#8217;s Seedlings</a>, the group blog to which Jim contributes.</p>
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		<title>By: Karl Hallowell</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1282</link>
		<dc:creator>Karl Hallowell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Mar 2006 20:02:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1282</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;That same care is most important for the design of any future political system, whether inspired by Rand or inspired by Plato. Inspiration is simply a motivational force--not a detailed blueprint. Laying on lashes to Rand may serve to sublimate unhealthy emotions for some, but it rather misses the point.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;

Well, I am puzzled to see that my valid criticism of Rand is considered &quot;sublimation&quot; of &quot;unhealthy emotions&quot;. If Rand is just used as inspiration, fine. I don&#039;t see particular problems with using an irrational source as inspiration for rational actions or theories. However, I see a significant group who seem to rely on her for more than that. See D. Vision&#039;s comment for an example.&lt;p&gt;

I don&#039;t think it&#039;s helpful to character an opposing point of view as &quot;anti-reason, anti-logic, anti-freedom, anti-life&quot;. That connotation pidgeon-holing comes directly from Rand and shouldn&#039;t be one of the things that inspires a rational being.&lt;p&gt;

Having said that, she is a remarkable author of her age, but in my humble opinion, Objectivism (and related philosophies) needs newer, more rational inspiration to put her arguments in context.
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>That same care is most important for the design of any future political system, whether inspired by Rand or inspired by Plato. Inspiration is simply a motivational force&#8211;not a detailed blueprint. Laying on lashes to Rand may serve to sublimate unhealthy emotions for some, but it rather misses the point.</i>
<p>Well, I am puzzled to see that my valid criticism of Rand is considered &#8220;sublimation&#8221; of &#8220;unhealthy emotions&#8221;. If Rand is just used as inspiration, fine. I don&#8217;t see particular problems with using an irrational source as inspiration for rational actions or theories. However, I see a significant group who seem to rely on her for more than that. See D. Vision&#8217;s comment for an example.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s helpful to character an opposing point of view as &#8220;anti-reason, anti-logic, anti-freedom, anti-life&#8221;. That connotation pidgeon-holing comes directly from Rand and shouldn&#8217;t be one of the things that inspires a rational being.</p>
<p>Having said that, she is a remarkable author of her age, but in my humble opinion, Objectivism (and related philosophies) needs newer, more rational inspiration to put her arguments in context.</p>
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		<title>By: Phil Bowermaster</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1281</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Bowermaster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Mar 2006 13:29:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1281</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yeah, Karl, quit being so dang giddy all the time. Personally, I&#039;m off to sublimate a few more unhealthy emotions.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, Karl, quit being so dang giddy all the time. Personally, I&#8217;m off to sublimate a few more unhealthy emotions.</p>
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		<title>By: legion</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1280</link>
		<dc:creator>legion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Mar 2006 08:52:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1280</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[All of this giddy criticism of Rand seems rather beside the point.  Think back to the US founding fathers and the checks and balances placed in the US Constitution.  The recognition that individuals are flawed and self-serving--corrupt--is written all through the document, in its carefulness to balance power.

That same care is most important for the design of any future political system, whether inspired by Rand or inspired by Plato.  Inspiration is simply a motivational force--not a detailed blueprint.  Laying on lashes to Rand may serve to sublimate unhealthy emotions for some, but it rather misses the point.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All of this giddy criticism of Rand seems rather beside the point.  Think back to the US founding fathers and the checks and balances placed in the US Constitution.  The recognition that individuals are flawed and self-serving&#8211;corrupt&#8211;is written all through the document, in its carefulness to balance power.</p>
<p>That same care is most important for the design of any future political system, whether inspired by Rand or inspired by Plato.  Inspiration is simply a motivational force&#8211;not a detailed blueprint.  Laying on lashes to Rand may serve to sublimate unhealthy emotions for some, but it rather misses the point.</p>
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		<title>By: Karl Hallowell</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1279</link>
		<dc:creator>Karl Hallowell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Mar 2006 18:50:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1279</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ironically, Ann Rand strikes me as part of the breed of parasites she decries. She wrote decent books and in that would be considered a producer. But her cult of personality and her dealings with those close to her strike me as very parasitic in nature. Perhaps that part gave her insight into this problem. But it also appears to have blinded her in other ways.

Second, I no longer believe in the existence of non-trivial self-evident propositions. There&#039;s always an underlying set of axioms and a semantics system that needs to be included. Too many schools of thought suffer from the delusion that their founding principles are &quot;self-evident&quot;.

In Rand&#039;s case, I have serious questions about why she needed to redefine things such as &quot;good/evil&quot; and come up with dubious (ie, packaged with heavy negative or positive connotations that shouldn&#039;t IMHO be present in philosophy) terms like &quot;anti-life&quot;. Why did she believe such a shuffling of the semantics was necessary? It taints her work.

Ultimately, I think objectivism and related philosophies will have to distance themselves from Rand (and perhaps have done so?). The problem is that Rand suffers from the symptoms of the age. The messenger is flawed and somewhat irrational. That means that we need to seperate the message from the messenger.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ironically, Ann Rand strikes me as part of the breed of parasites she decries. She wrote decent books and in that would be considered a producer. But her cult of personality and her dealings with those close to her strike me as very parasitic in nature. Perhaps that part gave her insight into this problem. But it also appears to have blinded her in other ways.</p>
<p>Second, I no longer believe in the existence of non-trivial self-evident propositions. There&#8217;s always an underlying set of axioms and a semantics system that needs to be included. Too many schools of thought suffer from the delusion that their founding principles are &#8220;self-evident&#8221;.</p>
<p>In Rand&#8217;s case, I have serious questions about why she needed to redefine things such as &#8220;good/evil&#8221; and come up with dubious (ie, packaged with heavy negative or positive connotations that shouldn&#8217;t IMHO be present in philosophy) terms like &#8220;anti-life&#8221;. Why did she believe such a shuffling of the semantics was necessary? It taints her work.</p>
<p>Ultimately, I think objectivism and related philosophies will have to distance themselves from Rand (and perhaps have done so?). The problem is that Rand suffers from the symptoms of the age. The messenger is flawed and somewhat irrational. That means that we need to seperate the message from the messenger.</p>
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		<title>By: Billy Beck</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1278</link>
		<dc:creator>Billy Beck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Mar 2006 15:06:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1278</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s remarkable, to me, to see someone refer to Rand after this article.

I had just been pondering the idea that &quot;reasonoing from first principles is a closed system,&quot; and concluding that that is bloody nonsense.

I know someone here who might seriously benefit from reading Rand&#039;s &lt;i&gt;&quot;Introduction to Objectivist Epistemology&quot;&lt;/i&gt; and thinking hard about what she has to say.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s remarkable, to me, to see someone refer to Rand after this article.</p>
<p>I had just been pondering the idea that &#8220;reasonoing from first principles is a closed system,&#8221; and concluding that that is bloody nonsense.</p>
<p>I know someone here who might seriously benefit from reading Rand&#8217;s <i>&#8220;Introduction to Objectivist Epistemology&#8221;</i> and thinking hard about what she has to say.</p>
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		<title>By: D. Vision</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1277</link>
		<dc:creator>D. Vision</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Mar 2006 09:57:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1277</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Have you read Atlas Shrugged? It&#039;s a must. Rand put her finger directly on the problem: the parasites of collectivism.

In a strange nexus, it&#039;s all the same: anti-reason, anti-logic, anti-freedom, anti-life. It&#039;s about control and distribution, equality, and dependence rather than freedom, production, quality, and independence. All such delusions are necessary to float collectivism--to maintain feelings above reason.

In the next century there will be great potential for collectivism to harness if its delusions are not countered and disarmed. The creep of &quot;need&quot; threatens to swallow us all in a mutually dependent liability that cannot allow freedom.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Have you read Atlas Shrugged? It&#8217;s a must. Rand put her finger directly on the problem: the parasites of collectivism.</p>
<p>In a strange nexus, it&#8217;s all the same: anti-reason, anti-logic, anti-freedom, anti-life. It&#8217;s about control and distribution, equality, and dependence rather than freedom, production, quality, and independence. All such delusions are necessary to float collectivism&#8211;to maintain feelings above reason.</p>
<p>In the next century there will be great potential for collectivism to harness if its delusions are not countered and disarmed. The creep of &#8220;need&#8221; threatens to swallow us all in a mutually dependent liability that cannot allow freedom.</p>
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		<title>By: Kathy</title>
		<link>https://blog.speculist.com/society/enlightenment-3-1.html#comment-1276</link>
		<dc:creator>Kathy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Mar 2006 19:22:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://localhost/specblog/?p=625#comment-1276</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[We need to learn critical thinking and logic on the one hand, and we need to be open to some things that are &quot;both and&quot; instead of &quot;either or.&quot; Otherwise we&#039;re in bondage to silly half-truths in pop culture and politics, and crappy fundamentalism in religion. I&#039;m currently very restless--almost obsessed--with breaking free of dogma. These books seem like important resources.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We need to learn critical thinking and logic on the one hand, and we need to be open to some things that are &#8220;both and&#8221; instead of &#8220;either or.&#8221; Otherwise we&#8217;re in bondage to silly half-truths in pop culture and politics, and crappy fundamentalism in religion. I&#8217;m currently very restless&#8211;almost obsessed&#8211;with breaking free of dogma. These books seem like important resources.</p>
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